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Posts made by Surrtan

  • RE: New Game Mode Ideas

    @b4njAx 1st of thank you so much for giving your feedback about my ideas ❤ Lets talk about it!

    @b4njAx said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    Problematic on a map like 665 though with the monster getting beamed every 60 seconds

    I thought about that too, and the best solution for that in my opinion is to have the monster cause the hazards! Like in Facility 665 for example, the monster would jump back on the objective point and shoot out the beam; forcing players to disengage (or come up with another crazy play because that's what we do).
    Or in Skygarden the monster would also jump back on the objective point and create the flames that are usually ignited when you activate the gong.
    What would also be interesting is if the monster would attempt to pull players into hazard while all that is happening.
    Ohh and please do not think about Jersey Sink. I'm not creative enough to think about what the monster would do with the trains.

    @b4njAx said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    I think Corporation Raid might be a better name though

    Honestly, for all I care they can call it despacito, just make the mode 😄

    @b4njAx said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    TERMINAL HACK
    The objective points spawn a pair of computer terminals and a teammate must sit on the point uninterrupted to download > unzip > upload to leak corporation files. Each part of the process counts as a notch in the progress so if interrupted you simply start the current task again. Each task is worth 5 points to complete, kills worth 1. If contested, the progress bar glitches out due to the interference for both teams.

    Won't this be too much like Objective Control though? I mean if I'm picturing it correctly, the goal will be to sit on the point, with the difference to Objective Control being that no one will get points while teams are contesting the terminal.

    @b4njAx said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    CACHE GRAB
    The objective points spawn big bulky corporation caches full of credits. Every second spent on the point, the fighter gains credits and slowly empties the cache. Multiple fighters can empty the cache at the same time, regardless of team. Each fighter's balance counts towards the team's total. Credits drop when killed and can be picked up by other fighters. First team to possess 5000 credits total wins. Fighters carrying more than 1000 credits will be slowed by something like 5% for each 1000 they possess. At the end of the match AND ONLY AT THE END, each player receives a 10% cut (i.e. a 500 credit bonus).

    This idea has potential imo. My favorite part being that credits get dropped when killed, meaning that basically (if I understood correctly) a team can reduce the amount of points that the enemy team has by stealing their credits. I think that this idea can be merged with your Terminal Hack idea to create a mode in which a team can hack into some system to steal or neutralize points that the enemy team has. This concept is unexplored in pvp games as far as I know, so I like it.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • RE: New Game Mode Ideas

    Oh my, thank you for having taken the time to both read and share your thoughts, fellow ghosts ❤

    @XxUnReached said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    A game mode like LOL mainly have would fit with bleeding with a map just for him.

    To be honest I do not share the same opinion. Mainly because a match of LoL takes around 25-30 minutes on average which is a bigger committment than the typical BE matches. Also I do not think that more depths (in terms of builds/progression) is good for BE. One of the good things about BE is that it is simple, and you can pick a character without thinking too much about how to build him/her.
    Instead I think the game needs more depths in terms of mechanics and perhaps side objectives/map play in order to allow more skill expression without overcomplicating the game.

    @Niksan3127 said in New Game Mode Ideas:

    I think modes are not something that needs to be added to the current version. Most of all, the game needs to fix the gameplay, heroes, balance.

    Well yea, no doubt it needs bug fixes among other things in order to be a less crap version of what we have today, but it needs more game modes in order to actually achieve something. Even if they fix all the bugs and balancing issues; bleeding edge will just be an okay game aimed at a small niche audience. Meanwhile the true potential of the game's concept needs the game to offer a much "bigger" gameplay experience anyone can even talk about realizing the game's potential.
    Tldr: A "better" version of today's gameplay experience will certainly please the already existing playerbase. We need a "bigger" version if the game ever wishes to grow.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • New Game Mode Ideas

    Hello Ghost Town!
    Yes I'm aware of the state of the game, and how it's extremely unlikely that anything I write here will be read by anybody, but writing is what I do best, and it's still fun to go wild with ideas, so I will just write.

    With that out of the way, I've been thinking about what new modes BE could have in addition to Objective Control and Power Collection, and I made a short list of conditions that new game modes should fulfill in order to remain true to the Bleeding Edge experience we have now.
    The conditions to be met by a game mode are:

    • It needs to be playable on all the maps
    • Both teams must compete for the same objectives (meaning no defending/attacking team etc.)
    • The average match duration should be 10-15 minutes, just like objective control and power collection
    • The mode must revolve around the map's objective points
      Additionally, the new mode should aim to create a slightly different playstyle. Meaning don't just replace cells with gold, call it Gold Collection and make it a new mode.

    Following the rules above, here are the Game Modes I thought of:

    MONSTER HUNT

    In Monster Hunt, a monster will spawn on an objective point, and teams must hunt it down and eliminate it in order to get points. Killing the monster grants the team 100 points, and 1st team to 600 wins.
    The monster spawns on an objective point, but it doesn't have to remain on the point; if players enter its radius it will attack them, and if players retreat it will move back to the objective point where it will regenerate.
    While fighting the monster, players will be granted buffs by dealing certain amounts of damage to it, this is in order to not put the attacking team at too big a disadvantage where the other team can just wait for them to start fighting the monster before collapsing on the objective and taking everything. But stealing the objective is still possible, should an enemy assassin manage to deliver the killing blow.
    Now imagine if there are different types of monsters, that would be so freaking cool o.o

    INVASION REPEL

    In this mode, Police forces or HA Corp forces have invaded the map through a portal on an objective point, and are now swarming the map hunting for the misfits. Teams must kill the invading forces and collect the key that will drop from one (or more) of the invading npcs. Upon optaining the key/s, the team must protect the key holder while they move towards the objective point and seal the portal that the invaders are coming from.
    Killing the key holder will drop the key, creating a chance for the enemy team to steal, or for a team mate to continue the job just like in cell collection.
    Killing an invading npc gives 1 point, killing a player gives 2 points, killing the key holder gives 3 points, and sealing the gate gives 10 points. First team to 100 points wins.


    Should a ghost or 2 among you have other ideas, I'd be very excited to hear about them, but please spare me the "dude the game is dead wtf are you wasting your breath for" comments, I know it, you know it, we all know it, we're just having fun.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • RE: Funny how this community doesnt move a single finger

    @IRIS-Xhang I remember you. We never played a match together as far as I know, but I've seen you (through completely coincidental watchzone encounters) trolling your games by moving from spawn to the electric fence (and dying) over and over, and doing similar troll behavior in other games, so my guess is that it had to do with that.

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • RE: The Great Tank Rework of 2021

    Everything you said here sounds pretty good. I'd love to see it

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • Damage resistance buffs/abilities cause reduced healing received.

    These game changing bugs have been discovered in the past 2 weeks:

    • Zerocool's Upgrade Protection super causes allies standing in it to receive 30% reduced healing (55% if Zerocool has the 25% extra protection mod)
    • Mekko's Safety Zone causes allies standing in it to receive 25% reduced healing
    • Defense Buffs in Landslide cause the one who picks them up to receive 25% reduced healing
    • Bastardo's damage resistance mods cause him to receive a reduced healing percentage equal to the damage resistance percentage given by the mod

    Also might be worth testing if Miko's mod that gives allies standing inside her Kinetic Shield damage resistance; also suffers from the same issue.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • A description of the different "skill levels" in Bleeding Edge

    One of the factors that lead towards improvement; is to understand what and how you are improving exactly. Thus, in this post we will attempt to package skillsets together into levels, and you can use these levels to develop a better understanding of where you currently stand, and where you can get better.
    Please note that this is not a "guide" in a strict sense, but rather a list of goals/objectives/requirements that once met, will mark your ascendance to the next level.
    If the game had ranks/elos I would instead say that these [could] be the requirements for each rank, but since we do not, we will have to theorize and use our imagination a little bit.

    LEVEL 1: THE SOLDIER

    • Understand how to play for the objectives; by collecting/delivering power cells, or capturing & guarding the active points.
    • Learn to use the mini-map for information on objectives and/or ally/enemy positions.
    • Make basic usage of your character's abilities. Meaning to heal your allies if you're a support, deal damage if you are a damage dealer, or protect your allies during team fights if you're a tank.
    • Most importantly: Learn to move with your team, and fight with them.

    LEVEL 2: THE CAPTAIN

    • Grow familiar with all the maps in the game (7 maps as of now), so you can move quickly and efficiently to where you are needed.
    • Understand the different map mods (12 as of now) and how they affect the way the match will go.
    • Master the character(s) that you main; by learning to make the best usage of their abilities, and finding the mods that suit your playstyle.
    • Know and understand what the abilities of the other fighters do, in order to work better with your allies, and understand the enemy strengths and weaknesses better.
    • Understand how to put together a basic team composition with supports, damage dealers, and tanks.

    LEVEL 3: THE VETERAN

    • Improve your Macro gameplay by grasping the concepts of positioning, map awareness, and overall game sense.
    • Improve your Micro gameplay by refining your mechanics; in form of learning to parry, evade, mixing up your attacks, and countering specific enemy abilities.
    • Learn to step out of your comfort zone and play a variety of roles/characters depending on what your team needs.

    LEVEL 4: THE MASTER

    • By now you should be able to recognize enemy mistakes and punish them for it
    • See the game through your opponent's eyes so you can predict their next move, bait out their evades/abilities, and basically be 1 step ahead of them.
    • With your great knowledge of the game you can get creative with mod builds, team compositions and/or ways to play your characters.

    LEVEL 5: THE GENERAL
    You have learned and mastered almost everything there is to learn in Bleeding Edge. The final skill for you to learn is to shotcall, and lead your team of (hopefully) level 2 (from this list) and above.
    Hats off to you General.


    With this we reach the end of this post. Should you have any questions or things I could help with, feel free to either reply to this thread, or find me (Sultan Cat) in the official Bleeding Edge discord.

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • RE: Feedback to the devs: What I think you're doing wrong

    @XxUnReached said in Feedback to the devs: What I think you're doing wrong:

    As you had said before for hold your feedbacks for next year,better when they finally decided to speak with us about their game or/and in other case give their situation for all this silence

    I meant that regarding feedback posted on discord. Forum threads better be up and ready to be read whenever the dev team does decide to come back. Meanwhile, if they don't read forum posts then that would be a catastrophe.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • Feedback to the devs: What I think you're doing wrong

    For a game as beautiful & fantastic as Bleeding Edge, it is very evident that there is a lot criticism coming from outside as well as from inside of the game's community. I want to say that I can only imagine how crappy it must feel to be so overwhelmed with demands and borderline hate while there is probably a lot that is outside of your control.
    In this thread I want to avoid making any demands (for updates and what not) and rather try to focus on giving objective feedback based on my observation at how some aspects of the game are being run.

    As mentioned at the start of the thread; there is absolutely no denying that Bleeding Edge is a very good game, and that you are all extremely talented and competent artists and game developers. I have yet to see a player that hasn't given praise to David Garcia's and Jamie Molloy's spectacular soundtracks, or Geralt & Andy's amazingly designed maps or Marco and Bao's very beautiful art; just to name a few of you. The game truly is a great product, but then what is going wrong in the eyes of your fans, and what exactly do they mean/want when they tell you to communicate more with them?
    In order to answer that, allow me to describe 1 aspect that we players care a lot about in games thats core idea is to be multiplayer, pvp, and (to some extent) repetitive like League of Legends, Dota, Overwatch and similar [purely] multiplayer titles, and that aspect is the developer of the game's vision/hopes/expectations for their game, and I wish to elaborate on what that means exactly:
    In many discussions about Bleeding Edge's future, there are 2 (failed) game titles that are mentioned in order to draw a comparison, one is Gigantic and the other is Lawbreakers, with Lawbreakers being the one that is relevant to the subject right now. In hindsight, the head figure of Lawbreakers "Cliff Bleszinski" made a mistake in seeming too cocky and pompous with the way he presented his game. Defining the game (Lawbreakers) as being a title for the most skilled and hardcore players, potentially scaring away some of the more casual players, but at the very least, he sent the message that he is very committed to his game, and wants to work on making it achieve greatest heights and compete with the biggest game titles out there.
    On the other hand, Bleeding Edge is making the EXACT OPPOSITE mistake. Instead of presenting the game in an ambitious manner (and risking being called pretentious or that it takes itself too seriously), Bleeding Edge is not even being presented IN ANY WAY AT ALL, so we, the players, have no idea what Ninja Theory hopes for or expects from this game. Does it even want to grow and become a big/popular title or not? We have no idea, because the developer's vision for this game is being kept a secret from the game's community. Does the game want to be big like overwatch and league of legends, or does it want to just "exist" in the gaming library, ready to be picked up by anybody but does not really care if people end up playing it or not.

    THE RESULT
    Is that we are presented with a game in which it seems like the developer does not believe in their game at all, so why should we?

    Yes the game is fun to play. For a while at least. After about 100 hours in the game; the act of playing it becomes an act of showing support to the game, in hopes that the unspoken promise of the game's developer using this support in order to move forward with the game that the community of is promising to keep playing and supporting, will be realized.
    Right now I can think of 2 possible explanations as to why the developers are allowing the game to remain in the state that its in right now:

    "But Sultan, we, the developers, are working on other Ninja Theory responsibilities, and things outside of our control are preventing us from resuming development on the game"
    In this case you have to tell the community exactly that. Be transparent (to some extent) with the community, and they will return your transparency, which also serves as a form of respect you are showing to the community, with patience and continuous support.

    "Sultan, we made the game and think of it like a ball. You can take the ball and play with it whenever you want and it doesn't really matter to anyone whether you play with it or not"
    If this is the case, then again you need to present this vision for your game to your community. If you truly have no intentions to reach greater heights with the game then that's fine, but you have to be transparent and let your community understand that this is how the game will be run, otherwise you're causing a lot of frustration in the community for no reason other than that you don't care about them.


    But all in all, I imagine that the real response to what I'm saying is:
    "Dude, we're game developers. Our job is to make the game. Presenting the game and managing the community is someone else's task"
    Which while being understandable, is also carefree in a negative sense. The Bleeding Edge community is facing a massive wall right now that makes it very difficult if not impossible to effectively communicate the game's state and problems to the party that needs to receive it. If on top of this wall you place a sign telling us that these problems are the responsibility of a party that does not exist (at least in our eyes) then you are killing your own community by letting these problems and frustrations continue to be recycled over and over until it turns into a tornado that will once and for all put an end to the game that we love.

    At the very least take this feedback and present it to someone within Ninja Theory or Microsoft that can be responsible for dealing with this type of issue.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • Tips for every individual fighter: How to use your character effectively

    Here is a compilation of some super useful tips for every individual fighter in the BE roster, that you can learn in order to be as effective as possible with them.
    I tried to make the post as short as possible to not scare off new players, so this is definitely not all there is to these fighters.

    TIPS FOR DAMAGE CHARACTERS

    Daemon:
    It's very useful for a Daemon to accurately estimate/calculate his damage output, so that he can preserve his low hp pool by only coming out of stealth once he knows he'll either eliminate the target or deal significant damage that will give his team the advantage. On the other hand it will suck if he would shift strike out of stealth into the enemy team, and all the targets are still above 50% hp.
    You want to not only land your skills, but also understand how much damage they will do.

    Nidhöggr:
    This one is a very popular skill. Nidhöggr players should practice their shredder so much until they learn the exact time it takes for the shredder animation to complete, and how to quickly start the shredder animation again by hitting the shredder input at the right time.

    Gizmo:
    It goes without saying that she better know how to parry, but another useful skill to learn is to control your jump pad. When fighters get hit they turn towards the direction they got hit from, and this can cause Gizmo to jump in the wrong direction if she got hit as she got on the jump pad.

    Maeve:
    Same as Daemon. Since Maeve is an assassin with low hp; you want to make sure that you understand exactly how much damage your Siphon/Basic attacks will do, and preferably use them when you know you'll eliminate your target and get the killing blow (aka don't siphon a full health target unless you know exactly what you are doing).

    Cass:
    The most important skill to have as a Cass is the ability to dodge all forms of CC, because if you get caught as Cass you're pretty much dead. So learn how to dodge Maeve's cages/Buttercup's yanks/Nid's boomitar, etc. and make sure to wait till the enemies have expended their CC tools before you blade dance on their graves.


    TIPS FOR SUPPORT CHARACTERS

    Miko:
    If you main Miko then you should learn the range of all her abilities including her kinetic shield. As a matter of fact, the size of her kinetic shield is the most important thing to learn imo. You want to know exactly where the shield will appear, so you can position yourself accordingly and cast it in a way that will cut off point blank projectiles (like a maeve siphon while she is very close to her target).

    Zerocool:
    Learn to PARRY!
    And also to keep an eye on your healing charge. A good zerocool will know when to stop healing during the fight in order to charge up and go back to do more healing when it is needed (aka don't just press the heal button and pray the fight ends soon).

    Kulev:
    Targeting! As a Kulev main you need to be a master of targeting the right ally/enemy. You need to always shield the right ally because if you can't do that, your Kulev is pretty much useless for the team. Shielding the wrong target is a lot less forgiving than cursing the wrong enemy.

    Azrael:
    1- Learn to stack your soul eaters as much as you can, which you do by attacking different enemies, and having your void wave hit as many enemies as possible.
    2- Learn to accurately track your allies and place your portal as close as possible to them. If you can learn to place the portal exactly on your allies, then you've mastered the Portal.


    TIPS FOR TANK CHARACTERS AND WHATEVER THE HELL BASTARDO IS

    Bastardo:
    Almost everything about Bastardo is self explanatory, so there isn't much you can get wrong, but if you want to take your Bastardo to the next level, then you should learn to always land your leap of faith. It is the only ability in his kit that can directly help your team (by stunning the enemies hit), and if you can stun more than 1 target while your team is close, then you've given your team a huge advantage.

    Buttercup:
    Buttercup's aerial attack is a very powerful launcher that can even send tanks flying, so use it to peel and to disturb the enemies as much as possible. Buttercup's Launch ability is also very useful to learn, because it enables her to quickly reach her destination without mounting up. If you see a distant ally requiring assistance, you can use your Launch to quickly reach them and immediately stagger the enemy as well.

    Makutu:
    Leg-it is an extremely powerful utility tool. Heck it can even make your whole team immune to stagger for a few seconds. Learn to make the most out of this ability.

    Mekko:
    The best thing you can do with Mekko is life-lining your allies and pulling them out of danger. If you learn to lifeline the right target and quickly pull them to safety, then you might have just made Mekko be viable again.

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • Developer Update (opposite of community update)

    In an attempt to close the rift between the dev team and community, I'll be trying to provide the equivalent of a "community update" but for the devs. This thread will try to summarize the state of the game and the game's community, so the devs can then analyse, interpret, and do their dev magic to move forward with the game.

    1ST OFF: BUGS AND TECHNICAL PROBLEMS THAT NEED FIXING

    • Death glitch/Fake death/Divine intervention: It still happens very often that a target gets killed, the kill sound gets triggered, but then they just keep running like nothing has happened.
    • Invisible & ghost cell cannisters: Cell cannisters will either become invisible, and one will have to guess where they are and attempt to hit them, or they appear on the map as well as on the field as cell cannisters, but actually they're not real, and all your attacks will pass through them.
    • Chrysalis troll: Azrael can take an ally with them into his chrysalis, but cancel the ability quickly before the crystal has formed. This causes the ally to lose control of their character (while still being attached to azrael), and Azrael can proceed to troll/sabotage by running with them into environmental hazards/enemy team/etc.
    • Damage resistance = reduced healing: Abilities/mods/buffs that give the user/ally damage resistance also cause the user/ally to receive reduced healing. This includes Zerocool's super Upgrade Protection, Mekko's Safety Zone, the Defense Buffs in Landslide, and all of Bastardo's mods that give him damage resistance.

    2ND THINGS 2ND: SYSTEMATIC FLAWS UPSETTING THE COMMUNITY

    • Leaderboards: All the matches are now ranked matches, whether we have 3 new players against 4 experienced players, or we have trolls/leavers or just don't wish to play a competitive ranked game. All games will have consequences on your global rank. Also, we need clarification on how the leaderboards determines the ranks exactly, as we have no clue.
    • Ranked mode/Quickplay mode: A ranked mode is a super essential feature in any and every competitive multiplayer game in this day and age, and we desperately want a ranked mode with elos and stuff, as well as a quickplay mode that does not affect our global ranking.
    • Punishment system not helping: Same players are trolling and sabotaging games for months. We've sent hundreds of reports but we always see the same players trolling in the same way.
    • Matchmaker: Experienced players are very tired of playing with/against brand new players who drag the overall quality of the match down. We need a solution.

    LAST BUT NOT LEAST: COMMUNITY SENTIMENT
    The community is extremely upset and unhappy about the silent treatment its been receiving for the past 3 and half months. Our feedback and suggestions remain to be ignored (or never confirmed to have been read) and we generally feel disrespected.
    Not every form of communication with us has to be an update; we just want simple replies sometimes.


    I left out everything involving the need for content updates and/or balancing changes. Rather I'm focusing on the root/fundamental problems that need to be lifted before we can move forward and enjoy the luxury of content updates.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • The Dev-Team has given (a little bit of) clarification

    For those of you who missed it:
    In a casual conversation with the customer support manager Tetris yesterday, he clarified that while there are no updates to be talked about for the time being, the game itself is not going to be shut down anytime soon as opposed to some concerns that the community has been having in the past 2 months, and that the game will continue to be supported.
    He also said that he is available from 8am to 5pm GMT on weekdays, for if you're experiencing technical difficulties or bugs or anything that he can help with.

    To summarize:

    • Is the game dead/dying? No. The game will continue to be supported
    • Any updates? None for the time being, but there is nothing to suggest there will not be any updates in the future
    • Have the devs given up on this game? Simply put: No.
    • Can we expect more communication from the side of the devs in the future? Sadly, nothing has been said about that.
    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • RE: Supports: Why Zerocool is the best but shouldn't be nerfed

    Regarding how to balance out the rest of the support roster:
    Kulev (and I'll always support this idea) needs anti-healing features to his curse; only that way can he truly be a valuable buffer/debuffer like he was meant to be.
    Azrael is in a good position as a secondary support imo, and if we're talking about secondary supports then Miko would also be in a good position (she is a bad version of Zerocool if played as a main support).

    Meaning we now have 1 main support/healer (Zerocool), 1 support that needs a buff in order to be a main support and an anti-healer (Kulev, who for now is just a weird fighter in general), and 2 secondary supports (Azrael and Miko). So aside from a Kulev buff, I honestly think that we need a new fighter that is a main support like Zerocool and [the hopefully buffed] Kulev.

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • Fighter Related Feedback

    I want to be as straight to the point as possible so I'll skip introductions and head directly to the suggestions:

    Bastardo's death spiral should not be interrupted by Makutu's uppercut.
    The intention was to make Makutu's uppercut work on tanks and shielded targets (yes I read the patch notes). Interrupting a special ability with your basic attack is just absurdly overpowered and it destroys Bastardo as a whole. Please change that.
    I'm begging you...

    Kulev's value in team compositions is smaller than it should be
    Kulev is meant to be a buffer/debuffer, but the debuffs he offers are of close to no value. His curse (which one can literally dodge) is very easily countered by Zerocool who is essential in every meta this game has had since launch. Kulev really needs anti-healing features.
    His other debuff Bamboozle can not only be interrupted by any form of cc, but Makutu can literally cleanse it off. Such a massive cooldown for such an easily countered ability.

    Azrael really needs more mods
    Compared to other fighters, Azrael is the fighter with the least amount of viable builds. Some of the mods straight up don't work ("Aggro" mod literally does not function at all) and generally his mods do not allow for any creative approaches compared to other fighters. Which is why it's your turn to get creative with him and give him some better mods 😉


    That's all from me. I'm sure that the community has more changes they would like to see, but in my oppinion, these 3 points are very essential.
    Thank you for reading

    posted in Feedback & Suggestions
    Surrtan
  • Learning the game: Who should you play?

    In this thread we're gonna try to give recommendations on which fighter(s) from the BE roster to play during which stage of one's learning process, while also elaborating on the reasoning behind each recommendation.

    The thread is mainly intended for beginner and intermediate players, since being an advanced player means that you're capable of bending the rules and finding creative ways to achieve what you need. With that being said; let's get started with the fighter recommendations.


    FIGHTER RECOMMENDATIONS FOR BEGINNERS:

    The fighters on this list are ones that do not carry big responsibilities, and that we can get away with depending mostly on just their basic attacks. The 1st lesson to learn is to basically allow the more experienced players on our team to carry us while trying our best to contribute at least a little. The fighters most suited for that are:

    Azrael:
    He's a melee support fighter, meaning that you'll be staying close to your team and fighting when they do. Sounds very simple, right?
    Just remember to place your guardian angel halo on an ally, and then proceed to playing as you please.

    El Bastardo:
    He's a little bit of a tank, and a little bit of a damage dealer, meaning that he has a lot of hp as well as the ability to dash and parry which makes him perfect for the learning process. As long as you make sure to move together with your team, it is hard to go wrong with Bastardo.

    Mekko:
    If you want to learn the art of ranged combat then Mekko is a good starting point. He is harder to kill than other ranged fighters thanks to his shield and high hp.
    However, with Mekko we have to at least try to use our abilities; meaning that when you see that your team is fighting you should place your safety zone where they are fighting, and then proceed to play as you please.

    Daemon:
    He's my last recommendation for beginners because he has very low hp and is therefore harder to stay alive with, but he is your pick if you want to go all out on dealing damage. Daemon has the fastest attack speed among all the fighters, and that means that once you engage on an enemy you are almost guaranteed to deal a huge amount of damage.
    Just, as usual, make sure to stay close to your team and fight when they fight.

    What are we hoping to learn at this stage?

    • How to stay and move with our team
    • How to fight (with our team)
    • How the game works, what our personal play-style is, our personal strengths & weaknesses, and basically the fundamentals of Bleeding Edge

    FIGHTER RECOMMENDATIONS FOR INTERMEDIATES:

    At this stage we want to share some of the responsibility of carrying our team to victory. The 2nd lesson is to widen our scope a little to see the bigger picture than just mindlessly hacking and slashing what's in front of us. To protect our team mates and to use our abilities to create advantageous situations for our team. The fighters suited for this lesson (in addition to the previous list) are:

    Nidhöggr:
    He is the strongest damage dealer in the game. Nidhöggr players have the responsibility of dealing crazy amounts of damage, and unlike Daemon, Nidhöggr must make full use of his abilities in order to achieve that damage output. So you want to be using your shredder whenever you think you can, and try to be a real sniper with your boomitar.
    You basically play Nidhöggr with the purpose of being a destructive killing machine with absolutely no mercy.

    Gizmo:
    If you want to do as much (if not more) damage as Nidhöggr, but while being purely a ranged fighter that deals damage with their basic attacks and uses abilities to create safe distances between yourself and the enemies, Gizmo is your girl.
    With Gizmo your purpose is to hold the fire button and only let go of it when you need to move to safety. However it is important to understand that the type of damage Gizmo delivers is aimed to "pressure" the enemy team, meaning that if you see them retreating, you'd be putting yourself in danger if you go for a chase. Let your team take care of that. Your job is to do free fire during the main battle.

    Makutu:
    While Makutu is generally safe to play thanks how hard to kill he is, the main purpose for playing Makutu should be to create opportunities for your team, and for that you need to make effective use of your abilities. Repel is used to either disengage from fights or to interrupt enemy abilities. Attract is best used to build up for your main offensive tool which is barging the enemies you've attracted straight into a wall; for a perfect kill opportunity that your team can follow up on.
    There are multiple fighters in the BE roster that qualify as playmakers, but Makutu is a fighter that is mainly a playmaker. Keep that in mind.

    What we want to learn at this stage is:

    • How to make the best use of your abilities
    • How to be a carry for your team
    • To understand your win condition as well as the enemy's win condition

    OTHER FIGHTERS AND WHY I DON'T RECOMMEND THEM:

    Zerocool: The responsibilty that Zerocool players carry is huge. Zerocool is literally the heart and most vital point of any team.
    Kulev: He is extremely dependent on his abilities, and the way(s) to use them is too complicated for beginners/intermediates.
    Maeve: While braindead, she is a fighter that can only be played effectively by advanced players.
    Buttercup: She teaches less about the game than Bastardo, and is generally worse than Makutu.
    Cass: She doesn't fit into most team comps, and what you learn while playing Cass cannot be translated into other fighters.
    Miko: She is very weak and picking her will put your team at a disadvantage because of how weak she is.


    Thank you for reading this bundle of tips and recommendations. See you on the battlefield!

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • The Misfit's Guide to Bleeding Edge (3): Team Compositions

    If you have taken the time to read the 1st 2 chapters of the Misfit's Guide, then that means that you're motivated to learn more about Bleeding Edge and become a master at it. If you haven't yet but you're interested, feel free to check out the guide(s) on fundamentals and mechanics.
    With that being said, welcome back to the Misfit's Guide 🙂


    This chapter of the guide will divide the concept of team comps into the following 2 sub-units:

    • How to build a good team composition
    • The value of some individual fighter picks in a team composition

    Some examples of compositions might be mentioned, but this guide is in no way a directory of all the viable compositions. Rather it will try to give a few guidelines to help you get creative from there and form your own teams.

    BUILDING A TEAM COMPOSITION:

    The 1st things one should know about the creation of a good team comp are the absolute essential components, and these are:

    • The frontline
    • The support
    • A gameplan

    The frontline is (as the name suggests) tasked with being the fighter(s) to stand at the front, and be the ones to start the team fights by going in 1st and allowing the rest of their team to follow. The frontline is also your main line of defense when your team is being engaged on. Picture them like the flag carrier that your team should gather around and pay attention to the calls of.
    The fighters that make for a good frontline are usually the tanks, with the slight exception of Mekko who would benefit from another frontliner to take some of the pressure off of them. Nidhöggr can also be considered a good frontliner since he has very high hp and good sustain thanks to his passive.
    A player that is a good frontliner is a player that is not only mechanically gifted, but a good shotcaller on top of that. As the frontliner you want to think of yourself as the captain leading the charge and taking charge when your team is being attacked.
    Without a frontline, your play-style will at least resemble guerilla tactics if you know what you are doing, meaning you'd be looking to quickly eliminate single out of position targets and avoiding prolonged teamfights. On the other hand if you don't realize what it means to not have a frontline; your fights will be extremely chaotic. You'll expect one of your melee fighters to pressure the free firing enemy gizmo or the shredder spamming enemy Nidhöggr, while the melee fighters will be waiting for literally anyone to engage on to the enemy team so they can follow and do their job (which will basically never happen).
    Thus it is important to understand the conditions that will unlock your team composition, and these conditions can also be referred to as your Gameplan.

    Some active members of the community that are very good frontline mains who you can ask for further advice and guidance are TheMythic and LoudJules they're super nice and will be able to provide more insight than me.

    The support is in my opinion the single most important member of the team. Their job is to keep their team alive during fights, with (again) the slight exception of Kulev who plays a more complicated role which we will elaborate on later in the guide.
    If we say the team should look at the frontline to know when to fight, then they should look at the support to know when to retreat. Ideally the support will be positioned at the backline and when you see them backing off and turning around to give minimal healing just to turn around again; that is them telling you to slowly retreat, so wrap it up and disengage.
    As we've briefly mentioned in previous guides, the supports are usually the enemy team's priority kill target, so a player that is a good support, is a player that understands the concept of positioning very well, is mechanically gifted (very important to be good at parrying) and capable of defending themselves while also focusing on giving their team the buffs that they require.
    As the support, it is (in most cases) your own responsibility to stay alive. If you get picked out of position; that's your fault. If you get eliminated at the start of the fight; that's you needing more practice in defending yourself. It only becomes the team's responsibility to look out for you once the fight has gone on for a bit, or when the enemy team is fiercly pushing forward trying to get to you. However, that's in terms of staying alive. If you're also expected to heal and do your job as the support, it becomes the team's responsibility to peel for you, so if you're too busy fighting off the enemy Cass/Maeve that is being ignored by everybody and chasing you around the whole time, it's your team's job to come peel for you (and also punish the solo cass/maeve for being in your backline).
    Unlike the case with the frontline; there is no play-style or tactic for a team with no support. None.

    Active members of the community that are very good supports who you can ask for further advice and guidance are Zero8533 and The Aladeen they're super nice and will be able to provide more insight than me.

    The gameplan is like we've said earlier; the conditions that should be met in order for your team comp to be unlocked and function well. For example, if your team comp has a Daemon, then you should be aware that he's an assassin that excels in eliminating the backline, so the gameplan (or at least an example of a gameplan in this case) is to create situations in which the enemy team is occupied fighting, which creates an opening for him to go straight for the enemy backline and destroy it. Or if your comp has a maeve, a gameplan is to try and unlock her through allowing her to get most of the kills.
    I suggest you read the Misfit's Guide on fundamentals so you can develop a better idea of what each fighter excels at or needs, so you can end up forming your gameplan when you see them in the game.

    After we've covered the essential picks of a team composition (in form of frontline and support), we can now move on to fill the slots that will give your team extra edge/safety/utility/etc. but this requires us to keep a very important concept in mind, which is that there should be a good balance between ranged and melee fighters in your comp. Why? Because of the advantages that both of these types bring.
    The main advantage of range fighters is (clue is in the name) the fact that they can do damage from a safe distance, but the problem with that is that enemies hit by ranged (basic) attacks will not flinch or stagger or be inconvenienced in any way (other than lose hp) and they can still move freely as they please or cast powerful specials without being interrupted; which brings us to the advantage of melee fighters.
    Melee fighters offer Hitstun with their basic attacks. Hitsun is the slight push/stun/disruption that happens when a fighter gets hit. While hitstunned you can not attack or parry or cast abilities, and this is very useful to have in order to control the flow of battle. Is the enemy Gizmo having a blast free firing at your team? The solution is a fighter that can hitsun her. Or is the enemy Nidhöggr spamming shredder? Hitstun!
    Thus if your team consist of 2 ranged fighters, the optimal situation is for the other 2 to be melee fighters (but not vice versa. 3 or even 4 melee fighters is not necessarily a problem. 4 ranged fighters is a catastrophe).

    Having said that, the specific choice of fighters you make from here on is dependent on what you would like to achieve in the match. Lets say you have a frontliner that is Buttercup, and a support that is Zerocool, what else do you need? For starters you could use some damage, so your 3rd team mate picks Gizmo.
    Our team comp now consists of Buttercup, Gizmo, and Zerocool, what will you pick?
    To make the best decision you need to consider the strengths and weaknesses of the comp. Zerocool is a ranged fighter and a superb support, but he needs someone to protect and peel for him, which Gizmo cannot do at all because while she offers great dps, she's also a ranged fighter (no hitstun) and is in need of protection/peeling herself, which Buttercup can do but only for 1 of the 2 (either Gizmo or Zerocool) so you now know that your team needs a melee fighter with the ability to peel.
    What kind of melee fighter?
    Do you want extra edge so your gameplan becomes to win teamfights through kills? Get a Daemon or a Nidhöggr.
    Do you want utility in form of mobility around the map and some healing? Azrael is your pick.
    Or maybe you want to win through outlasting the enemy team and winning the prolonged team fights? A tank like Makutu or Bastardo should work.
    Or perhaps you like taking risks and you want to either go big or go home? Cass is your risky pick that can either cost you everything by being a 3rd squishy fighter on your team, or win you everything by being a beast and blade dancing on the enemy team's graves.

    In short: consider the strengths and weaknesses of your team mates, and pick according to that.

    INDIVIDUAL PICKS AND THE VALUE THEY OFFER:

    After finishing the part about making a general and relatively basic composition, I want to be a little more specific and talk about exact fighters and how they (should) shape the gameplan/play-style if picked, and I'm gonna do that by dividing the Bleeding Edge roster into 3 categorites:

    • Carries
    • Trump cards
    • Secondary supports

    Starting with the carries. Those are the fighters that have the best shot at being the MVPs of games, and in most if not all cases, the ones that the rest of the team should play around.
    They are:

    Buttercup:
    She's a good frontliner and a better tank. During fights she offers very good damage, very good peeling, good cc and ability interruption, and when it comes down to it she is good at escaping and staying alive.
    Buttercup is in fact one of the easiest fighters to carry games with. Rarely do people want to face her in a 1v1, and the power she gives while with her team is massive.

    Makutu:
    Read everything I said about Buttercup, and now in Makutu's high pitched voice read: anything you can do I can do better.
    Makutu is an absolute monster, but unlike the case with Buttercup, he is not what I would describe as easy, but rather for more advanced players. Only the maddest of men dare to face this beast in a 1v1, and only the best of them can live through it. In a team he deals obliterating damage if left alone, and also be a big risk if targetted. CC? check. Healing? check. Damage? check. Utility? check. Victory guaranteeing ultimate that only 2 fighters can "stop" and no one can counter? check.
    I pledge allegiance to the Makutu.

    Zerocool:
    Although his ability to carry has grown weaker ever since his healing and damage output both got nerfed, Zerocool is still able to carry games by giving his team mates not 1, not 2, not 3, not 10, but a close to infinite amount of second chances thanks to his superb healing.
    Zerocool is a pick that will (more like should) make the game a lot more forgiving for the rest of his team, and if you're a good player that can keep himself alive, BE turns basically into a waiting game. Waiting for when your team will finaly land their abilities and win the fight.

    Next are the trump cards. Those are fighters that are not expected to, but have the power to completely turn the game around. Those are:

    All 5 damage characters:
    Meaning Daemon, Cass, Gizmo, Maeve, and Nidhöggr.
    There is not much to be said about their role. They do damage, get kills, and those among them with the ability to peel can peel. Sounds basic, is easy to do, but those of you who actively play the game know how much we all wish to see more of these things being done in our games.

    Bastardo:
    Definitely a trump card. Nobody expects Bastardo to do something impressive in matches. Instead they send him to pressure Gizmo and hope he doesn't die.
    His trump card potential shines with his super ability Overload. Everybody laughs at Bastardo until they hear ENERGY SHALL BE FREEEEE and you see them all running for their lives.
    But he also offers the value of being an off-tank. Bastardo is not like other tanks in the sense that he is a bad frontliner. Instead he makes it difficult for the enemy team to engage on and dive his own team.
    Bastardo players usually make the mistake of being the initiators. They leap into the enemy team and start spinning, which ends badly since all the enemy team needs to do is interrupt his death spiral and burst him instantly before his team can follow up.
    The (in my humble opinion) correct way of playing him is to be aggressively defensive. Let the enemy team engage, and now the battle becomes a free real estate since any cc ability they use to cancel your spiral is one that they now can't cc the rest of your team with. Meanwhile you can leap of faith to cancel key enemy abilities like Cass's dance with death, or to chase the enemy team that has now realized their mistake of diving a team with a Bastardo.

    Kulev:
    In my opinion, Kulev is the most misunderstood fighter in the game because everybody expects him to be a healer, when actually he kinda sucks at healing. Kulev is best described as a joker or a magician. He serves the purpose of filling in blanks for your team.
    What do I mean by that? I mean that for a short moment he will make up for a shortcoming that his team has.
    For example, because his shield ignores hitstun as well as give shield hp, he can turn any melee dps into a frontliner. Daemon can dive after getting a shield and you got yourself a very good iniation with shift strike.
    Or because his curse makes the target extremely vulnerable, he can turn his whole team into assassins for a short moment by cursing the closest enemy fighter.
    See what I mean by magician? Kulev's value in a team comp is to fill holes and make up for the team's shortcoming by buffing them and debuffing the enemy.
    But yes, he still could use extra abilities like something that would make enemy fighters deal less damage, and his passive could really use a buff as well. Hi devs.

    Finally we get to the secondary supports and the only 3 fighters left, and those are:

    Azrael:
    Remember how I said Zerocool makes the game more forgiving for everyone else? well Azrael makes the game more forgiving for Zerocool. Ideally you want your Guardian Angel halo to be placed on Zerocool, and then you fight as you please, but I want to call attention to the importance Azrael's portal. Most Azrael players make use of their portal, but most of their team mates do not. Guys when you have an Azrael on your team, be on the look out for his portals for they can save your lives. Too many times have I placed a portal for a team mate that was caught out of position, and they decided to walk around it or just ignore it completely.

    Mekko:
    He's a good tank, but not a good frontliner. Mekko makes it a little difficult to draft a good team comp since picking another tank will mean your team won't have enough damage, and expecting him to do all the tasks of a tank will be met with disappointment.
    But he's a good component of an off-meta comp. He works pretty well with Kulev, and together they can make their team very tanky which is good for objective control and holding points.

    Miko:
    I don't think I have any way of sugarcoating this one... Miko has been gutted with her last nerf. Absolutely gutted. The only value I can think of is her kinetic shield to cut off Zerocool's healing or work with Makutu to put extra cheese on that cheese cap since Azrael's wingblast doesn't go through the shield. Otherwise forget Miko exists for now. Sorry Aladeen.
    (if you don't know the cheese cap please do not ask what it is).


    We've come to the end of the 3rd chapter of the Misfit's Guide. I hope that it was at least a little bit insightful and was able to teach something about team comps. I also really hope that it won't be the last chapter, but our fate is in the hands of the devs and if they're going to end their period of silence.
    Until then Misfits!

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • RE: What's Next for Bleeding Edge?

    I only joined the community during the beta stage, but I remember that things were looking a lot brighter at the time, and it's indeed like you say that people would discuss and have more meaningful talks after games.
    What happened is basically the natural thing to follow when you suddenly disappear and leave the food in your fridge untouched for months; it goes bad.
    Posts from the devs began to decrease, complaints from the community were either ignored, not seen, or just never confirmed to have been read.
    Some players left, and those who stayed grew more and more impatient because change wasn't coming, and when the devs did make a post, it almost never offered any explanation to what is going on; instead we felt like the devs were pretending that absolutely nothing was wrong.
    With time impatience has grown to frustration. You can call that frustration toxicity and I wouldn't blame you, but I believe that it's a justified backlash to how the community has been suddenly neglected and forgotten about.

    I really hope this reaches the devs and helps us all move forward with the game.
    Thank you for taking the time to write all this!

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • The Misfit's Guide to Bleeding Edge (2): Mechanics

    After some thought, and a lot of constructive feedback from the community, I came to the conclusion that the last guide had left many aspects of the game without doing them justice. Therefore I've decided to come up with more guides to help players both new and old to hopefully undestand the game better.
    This installment of the Misfit's guide will attempt to dive a little deeper into mechanical concepts of the game. However, I ask of you that you bare in mind that a written guide may only serve as a starting point with basic instructions. I can't teach you how to perform sick plays nor can I offer you the tools with which you can do so, all a guide can do is prepare you enough so you'd be ready to come up with the rest on your own. With that being said, lets get started.

    This guide will divide the idea of mechanics into the following concepts/sub-units:

    • Mechanics revolving around basic attacks
    • Game sense involving usage of stamina
    • The mechanic of parrying
    • Some tips about landing individual fighter abilities

    Mechanics revolving around basic attacks (does not apply on ranged fighters):

    Most if not all fights, come down to who is better at performing their basic attacks. Mashing the attack button is in most cases ill advised because it will result in your fighter performing their default chain of basic attacks in the default speed that their kit was designed with. This means that your opponent can now learn the default chains of fighters, and end up parrying your attacks with ease. To counter this we depend on mix ups and/or emote cancelling.
    Mixing up your attacks means to use an ability somewhere in your chain of basic attacks. The most common example is Daemon throwing a shuriken after 3 or 4 basic attacks; this resets your combo, and if your opponent is anticipating the final attack of your default chain, they will instead be met with a shuriken followed by the 1st attack of the chain followed by the rest of the combo resulting in massive damage that could erase a Nidhöggr's hp bar depending on your mod build.
    Emote cancelling means to press the emote button to cancel your chain of attacks. Again this will reset your basic attack chain, and if your opponent is waiting for a certain attack in the chain that they know how to parry, they'll be waiting for a long time since you are basically performing the 1st or 2nd attack over and over and over again.
    The principle is to find the perfect frame in which an emote input will cancel your attack animation, and pressing the attack button in very quick succession to the emote input. Or if you want to play mind games with your opponent; actually emote in the midst of kicking their ass.
    Joreyo Sensei, the king of mechanics, has a useful video regarding emote cancelling that you may check out if you'd like: Emote cancelling by Joreyo

    Game sense involving usage of stamina (does not apply on tanks other than Bastardo):

    Right next to your hp, one of the most important things that you should make it a habit to keep an eye on; is stamina. The game is designed so that ranged fighters have 2 bars of stamina while melee fighters have 3. Evading or dashing costs you 1 stamina bar, and parrying successfully will restore half a stamina bar, moving on.
    A mistake that many players do is that they waste their stamina by using it to close up distance with their opponent (without a plan) or evading the small poking attacks and being left with no stamina to dodge more dangerous abilities like a Boomitar or a Cage. A general advise is to keep your last stamina bar available for emergency situations, until you're confident in your game sense enough to decide when to use your stamina on your own.
    While playing ranged fighters you want to be extra careful about using your stamina. Ideally when evading you want to create an opportunity to actually get away, for example by placing a firewall or jumping to safety.

    The mechanic of parrying (does not apply on tanks other than Bastardo):

    Parrying is easily the scariest concept for new players, but when they pull it off once or twice they being to realize that it's actually extremely simple with little to no risk to go with it.
    In order to perform a parry, you have to press the evade button (once) during the few frames that the enemy attack is supposed to connect with you, meaning after the attack animation has begun, and I would advise against trying to anticipate the attack, because your opponent could be mixing up their attacks and you would just fail the parry. And make sure that you are not mashing the parry button, because the failed parry animation does not get cancelled, and instead you will just spend more time standing idly and getting hit.
    To learn to parry I suggest that you practice against a Nidhöggr, a Bastardo, or a Buttercup because they have slow attack animations, and learn to parry the rest by getting your ass kicked in battle 😄 (at least for a while).

    Some ability tips for individual fighters:

    In this part of the guide I want to only make a few remarks on fighter abilities.
    Bleeding Edge uses auto aim/lock and is often (wrongfully) mocked because of that. In reality I have probably not seen a game in which people miss their abilities more than BE, and it directly results in them losing team fights that they should have won. Thus I want to call attention to some abilities that miss way too often, and how to rectify that. Ideally people would practice their abilities in the dojo, but it seems like the auto aim system has lead everybody to a false sense of security, that we now have to give tips on how to land stuff.

    Azrael's Wingblast: I believe this is the only skill shot in the game. Wingblast does not lock onto any enemies, and it will shoot exactly in the direction that you are facing, so make sure that you're actually facing the enemies when using it, and avoid using it when you are up (high) in the air, because Wingblast will not move in a diagonal direction, and will shoot at the same (vertical) height as you.

    Bastardo's leap of faith: Easily the most frequently missed ability in the game.You should avoid using leap of faith on enemies that are too close, because it will most likely miss, and if you are chasing a running enemy, try to jump up in the air before leaping, it'll increase the chance of landing on a moving target. BUT MOST IMPORTANTLY, enter the dojo and learn the maximum distance that a leap of faith can travel, and avoid using it on enemies that are out of reach. Leap of faith can cancel enemy abilities and that's a powerful tool to have, so make sure to learn how to use it.

    Cass' blade dance: The speed in which you can travel while in blade dance animation is only equal to your base movement speed, so try to position yourself so that you'll at least get some damage done before you use it.

    Daemon's shift strike: This ability does not automatically move towards your enemy, so make sure to be facing towards the enemy (unless you are trying to escape) and learn the maximum distance it travels so you can know when to activate it. Shift strike does very good AoE damage that can finish off enemies or turn the tides of battle.

    Gizmo's Sucka: Sucka does massive AoE damage and I only see few Gizmo players use it on enemies that are cuddled up together. Yes it's a good idea to use it on the 1 enemy that is chasing you, but like shift strike, sucka can really devastate the enemy team in a team fight with how much damage it does.

    Nidhöggr's Boomitar: Boomitar is very easy to evade, so if you're not certain that it will stun the enemy, enter the dojo and learn the maximum distance it travels (with/without range mod) and try to hit it at or close to maximum range. The closer the enemy is standing to its maximum range, the more difficult it is to dodge the returning boomitar. Or you can try to hit a wall with it (after if it has hit an enemy), and it will stun them instantly.


    Thank you for reading this part of the Misfit's Guide.
    If you want to read more about the fundamentals of Bleeding Edge you may check out the guide on fundamentals here: The Misfit's Guide to Fundamentals
    So long folks!

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
  • RE: The Misfit's Guide to Bleeding Edge: Fundamentals

    I was actually thinking about doing that. It sounds like the best approach to make the most accurate guides, but like I said, I'm gonna need people to cooperate

    posted in Bleeding Edge General
    Surrtan
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